“ESG is data at the end of the day. And more information is always better than less information. ”
— Jamie Friedland
My guest today is Jamie Friedland, a former U.S. Treasury trader turned sustainability analyst at AXA Investment Managers – one of the world’s largest and most active players in sustainable investing.
Jamie grew up on Long Island, the son of two lawyers – his mother became a law professor, and his father worked as a corporate attorney. Sports and school shaped a lot of his early life. He was serious about both, but tennis opened doors.
At age ten, he trained at what was then the Nick Bollettieri Academy (now IMG), where he once beat an eight-year-old Maria Sharapova in a junior’s match. A few years later, she broke out on the international stage. Jamie took a different path.
He finished high school at a boarding academy in Texas and earned a tennis scholarship to Northwestern, where he studied economics and communications. He’d been drawn to business from early on – books like Liar’s Poker pulled him in, capturing the rush and edge of the financial world. He didn’t know exactly where he’d land, but he knew he wanted in.
After graduating, Jamie joined Traditum, a proprietary trading firm based in Chicago. He started on the U.S. Treasury desk, trading interest rate spreads. Eventually, he moved to the firm’s New York office to help build out its fixed income business.
As he gained experience, Jamie turned his focus to a part of the market most traders ignored: cash bonds. While others concentrated on futures, Jamie noticed inefficiencies in how data moved between cash and futures markets. He began developing new strategies – and over time, taught others to spot those same opportunities.
Trading felt natural to him. Coming from a sports background, the instant feedback clicked: “At the end of the day, you get to say I was X amount smarter or X amount dumber than the rest of the community today.”
But eventually, the work started to feel hollow. A family friend running a marine mammal rescue nonprofit asked Jamie to help think through their business model. That consulting experience opened his eyes.
He began supporting other impact ventures – a digital ID startup for refugees, an Australian eye care company – and noticed a pattern: mission-driven teams that lacked financial fluency. Meanwhile, the capital and expertise in traditional finance rarely reached those organizations.
The gap was clear, and Jamie started wondering if he could help bridge it.
He went back to school, pursuing an MBA at NYU Stern with a focus on sustainability and impact. During that time, he worked with Developing World Markets, an asset manager that invests exclusively for impact.
But Jamie wanted to operate at scale. In March 2022, he joined AXA Investment Managers – now part of BNP Paribas Group. Within the group, BNP Paribas Asset Management oversees over €716 billion in assets, while the broader platform manages around €1.5 trillion globally.
Approximately 90% of listed assets are classified under Article 8 or 9 of the EU’s Sustainable Finance Disclosure Regulation, meaning they integrate sustainability or have a dedicated sustainable objective (source: BNP Paribas/ AXA Investment Managers (Core) as of end of 2024.)
At AXA, Jamie works in a central ESG role, focused on public investments and helping integrate sustainability across equities, fixed income, infrastructure, and alternatives.
What makes AXA’s approach unique isn’t just the scale. It’s the structure. Every company is assessed through an internal ESG framework that blends external data from providers like MSCI with qualitative inputs from in-house analysts. This allows them to score the entire investable universe – even in challenging areas like U.S. high yield, where 30% of issuers may be unrated by traditional providers.
The results are detailed – and sometimes strict. AXA applies hard exclusions in its green bond strategies. Nuclear energy, for example, is allowed in conventional mandates and in unlabeled strategies that hold green bonds. But it’s left out of AXA’s official green bond funds – because some clients have made it clear they don’t want it included in the list of eligible projects.
AXA’s green bond exposure is about €36 billion—but that’s not the size of their green bond fund. Most of those bonds live outside labeled strategies. Some desks hold them to hit internal KPIs. Others just like the bond and consider the green label a nice extra.
This is the real balancing act – between client preferences, shifting regulation, and ESG data that’s still catching up. Jamie likens it to steering a tanker: slow to move, but once it shifts, the weight behind it is massive.
One of the main tools for driving change is engagement. AXA uses a three-strikes policy: if a company flagged for ESG issues doesn’t show real progress within three years, they exit.
But it’s not about taking a victory lap. Jamie’s point is that influence is hard to measure. AXA might engage with a company, and that company might later publish a sustainability report or set a climate target – but that doesn’t mean AXA caused it.
What matters more is how the company responds when pressure shows up. And in some corners – like U.S. high yield – that response can be fast. Jamie has seen companies publish sustainability reports or announce climate goals within months of AXA initiating dialogue.
Data drives all of it. AXA tracks emissions intensity, year-over-year decarbonization, and Paris alignment across portfolios. They even assign color-coded scores – red to dark blue – showing how far along companies are on the path to net zero. Few earn the highest rating, but that’s not the point. The focus is progress.
Still, ESG doesn’t operate in a vacuum. The backlash – especially in the U.S. – has been loud, often political, and sometimes confusing. Jamie’s answer is disarmingly simple: ESG is just data. And more information is always better than less.
Looking ahead, he sees two forces shaping the future: First, better data – more accurate, more transparent, and harder for companies to hide from. And second, the sustainability challenges emerging from AI and its massive energy demands.
Jamie doesn’t sugarcoat sustainable investing. He knows it’s messy. That even well-intentioned companies miss the mark. That perfection isn’t the goal. But from his vantage point – inside one of the world’s largest asset managers – he’s trying to move capital in a direction that’s more aligned with the world we want to build.
Today, he’s here to walk us through how that actually happens. Tune in.
–
DISCLAIMER: This communication does not constitute on the part of AXA Investment Managers a solicitation or investment, legal or tax advice.
Due to its simplification, this document is partial and opinions, estimates and forecasts herein are subjective and subject to change without notice. There is no guarantee forecasts made will come to pass. Data, figures, declarations, analysis, predictions and other information in this document is provided based on our state of knowledge at the time of creation of this document. Whilst every care is taken, no representation or warranty (including liability towards third parties), express or implied, is made as to the accuracy, reliability or completeness of the information contained herein. Reliance upon information in this material is at the sole discretion of the recipient. This material does not contain sufficient information to support an investment decision.
–
Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Overcast, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Castbox, YouTube Music, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. You can watch the interview on YouTube here.
What was your favorite quote or lesson from this episode? Please let me know in the comments.
SHOW NOTES:
[00:00] Introduction
[04:19] Childhood and early influences in Long Island and tennis
[05:21] National junior tennis career and Sharapova match story
[07:08] Choosing Northwestern and preparing for business
[10:05] Joining Traditum to build U.S. Treasury trading desk
[14:49] Advising South Florida marine nonprofit on revenue strategy
[17:53] Pursuing MBA focused on sustainability and finance at NYU Stern
[22:04] Joining Developing World Markets during COVID to deepen impact focus
[25:54] Transition to AXA for larger-scale sustainable investing
[27:13] AXA’s structure, scale, and global ESG footprint explained
[32:41] AXA’s three-pillar sustainability and ESG framework overview
[34:26] ESG integration in public markets and portfolio alignment
[38:36] Defining the investment universe and ESG screening layers
[41:36] AXA’s rejection process for questionable green bonds
[45:06] Excluding nuclear from green bonds
[48:11] Clients’ ESG preferences shaping nuclear exclusion policies
[50:52] Post-investment emissions data used as core KPI
[52:43] AXA’s proprietary ESG scoring fills market coverage gaps
[56:47] The three-strikes policy defines engagement and exit timing
[01:00:07] ESG risk management strategies and reputational safeguards
[01:02:35] Pushback against ESG and the role of data
[01:05:41] Innovations in ESG driven by better data access
[01:12:01] Rapid fire questions
Additional Resources:
- Jamie Friedland LinkedIn
- Axa Investment Managers website
- Full-year 2024 earnings
- BNP Paribas Asset Management
- Point of No Returns 2025: A responsible investment benchmark of 76 of the world’s largest asset managers:
MORE QUOTES FROM THE INTERVIEWS:
“I think AI is going to be the biggest challenge for the sustainability community holistically. We’re already seeing companies in the tech sector slow down or adjust their decarbonization commitments based on anticipated energy needs. ”
— Jamie Friedland
“We often think of sustainability as a simple concept, but it can be both incredibly broad and deeply niche, depending on how you approach it. ”
— Jamie Friedland
